> General Discussions
Physical Bodies at ressurrection
Kat:
The way it looks to me is that the spirit being, were created from the beginning as spirit/messenger beings, so when their time of judgment comes they will be judged as such.
2Peter 2:4 For if God spares not sinning messengers, but thrusting them into the gloomy caverns of Tartarus, gives them up to be kept for chastening judging;" (CLV)
Jude 1:6 Besides, messengers who keep not their own sovereignty, but leave their own habitation, He has kept in imperceptible bonds under gloom for the judging of the great day." (CLV)
These spirit/messengers are a separate creation from the human creation and it is humanity that God is putting through the process of making into His image.
Heb 1:13 Now to which of the messengers has He declared at any time, "Sit at My right, till I should be placing Thine enemies for a footstool for Thy feet"? (CLV)
v.14 Are they not all ministering spirits commissioned for service because of those who are about to be enjoying the allotment of salvation?
Where is there a scrpture that states that people in the resurrection from the dead will be spirit beings, apart from 1 Cor. 15 where Paul is speaking to the believers? I can not find any. But there are Scripture that indicate they will be flesh and blood.
Eze 37:4 Again He said to me, "Prophesy to these bones, and say to them, "O dry bones, hear the word of the LORD!
v. 5 Thus says the Lord GOD to these bones: "Surely I will cause breath to enter into you, and you shall live.
v. 6 I will put sinews on you and bring flesh upon you, cover you with skin and put breath in you; and you shall live. Then you shall know that I am the LORD.""'
mercy, peace and love
Kat
pylady:
Hi Fe,
One thing we do know for sure - Jesus while on earth set the pattern for all mankind. He was begotten by His Fathers spirit while a man on earth, and then raised with a glorious spirit body. Every person on earth must follow that pattern. The elect in this age are begotten by God's spirit and will be raised with glorious spirit bodies next (following Jesus). The rest of mankind will be begotten of God's spirit in the next age while in the flesh (following the pattern), and then will be raised with a glorious spiritual body.
Satan is not of mankind, but he certainly has not inherited God's kingdom. But it seems if he too is to be saved in God's time He will deal with him in the best way. But it will be different from the way he deals with mankind since Satan is not flesh but spirit already.
1Cor 15: 42,43 "So also is the resurrection of the dead. It is sown a perishable body, it is raised an imperishable body; it is sown in dishonor, it is raised in glory, it is sown in weakness, it is raised in power;"
Of course, this scripture is speaking of the elect now, but all mankind follow. From perishable body (flesh), to imperishable body (spirit).
Just my thoughts,
Cindy
fe32k:
Hi Dewey,
I understood every part of that excerpt. But unfortunately it is one of Ray's teachings I do not quite see eye to eye yet. Either God has not opened my eyes to it or God hasn't opened Ray's eyes to it (very possible). But this is not a forum for arguing Ray's teachings so I will respect that rule and refrain from doing so. I will say however that the excerpt you posted does not answer my question. I don't know or assume anything. I just sincerely want a scriptural answer. Ray says in your excerpt that he knows of no spirit with tendons muscles and what not, but I do know one thing; Ezekiel 37:8 is a vision and why is Ray taking that vision literally is beyond me (literally beyond me, because I do not understand). If anything I learned from Ray is to not take visions literally.
Thanks!
Fe
mharrell08:
--- Quote from: fe32k on October 19, 2008, 09:10:44 PM ---Hi Dewey,
I understood every part of that excerpt. But unfortunately it is one of Ray's teachings I do not quite see eye to eye yet. Either God has not opened my eyes to it or God hasn't opened Ray's eyes to it (very possible). But this is not a forum for arguing Ray's teachings so I will respect that rule and refrain from doing so. I will say however that the excerpt you posted does not answer my question. I don't know or assume anything. I just sincerely want a scriptural answer. Ray says in your excerpt that he knows of no spirit with tendons muscles and what not, but I do know one thing; Ezekiel 37:8 is a vision and why is Ray taking that vision literally is beyond me (literally beyond me, because I do not understand). If anything I learned from Ray is to not take visions literally.
Thanks!
Fe
--- End quote ---
Hello Fe,
That is an excellent point regarding not taking a vision literally. But what about the rest of Ezekial 4?
5 Thus saith the Lord GOD unto these bones; Behold, I will cause breath to enter into you, and ye shall live:
6 And I will lay sinews upon you, and will bring up flesh upon you, and cover you with skin, and put breath in you, and ye shall live; and ye shall know that I am the LORD.
7 So I prophesied as I was commanded: and as I prophesied, there was a noise, and behold a shaking, and the bones came together, bone to his bone.
8 And when I beheld, lo, the sinews and the flesh came up upon them, and the skin covered them above: but there was no breath in them.
9 Then said he unto me, Prophesy unto the wind, prophesy, son of man, and say to the wind, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Come from the four winds, O breath, and breathe upon these slain, that they may live.
10 So I prophesied as he commanded me, and the breath came into them, and they lived, and stood up upon their feet, an exceeding great army.
11 Then he said unto me, Son of man, these bones are the whole house of Israel: behold, they say, Our bones are dried, and our hope is lost: we are cut off for our parts.
12 Therefore prophesy and say unto them, Thus saith the Lord GOD; Behold, O my people, I will open your graves, and cause you to come up out of your graves, and bring you into the land of Israel.
13 And ye shall know that I am the LORD, when I have opened your graves, O my people, and brought you up out of your graves,
This is a prophecy that has to come to pass. No, the Lord is not going to literally raise 'these bones' from the vision but He will eventually raise bones into physical bodies.
Also, have you ever read a scripture that you believe states that the wicked/unbelievers/called would be raised into a spiritual, immortal body? It's one thing to not agree with the scriptures given, but is there another scripture you believe states otherwise. I'm not trying to be a smart-aleck; I am just wondering how this thinking of all with spiritual bodies came about. I hope we, the other members, can help you find the answer you seek.
Thanks,
Marques
cjwood:
hi fe,
as arcturus pointed out from an excerpt from one of ray's teachings, "God is in full control of satan".
we cannot reason with our human brains how God will transform satan after he has been cast into the lake of fire.
satan was created by God for His purposes. you cannot try to reason about evil humans upon resurrection by comparing them to an evil spirit satan. it's not apples to apples. it's apples to oranges.
i pray that God will show you His Truths in your spirit pertaining to the lake of fire. all who have studied diligently the teachings of God regarding the truth about the lake of fire, which are and have always been testified of in His scriptures, and expounded to us by the spirit of Jesus Christ through our brother ray smith KNOW by that same spirit of Jesus Christ, that God indeed has opened ray's (spiritual) eyes of understanding on this matter. no ifs ands or buts.
claudia
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